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KevinBooth
Part 1


Part 2


Part 3


Part 4


Part 5


Part 6


Part 7


Part 8


Part 9

Zero
Thanks for linking this, although I'm not an US citizen this is very interesting. Makes you wonder how much else everyone takes for granted.
BadAlbert
Good documentary, I'm only up to part 5 so far though.
Corbin
probably one of the most important films ever made, be sure to watch it all the way through, the last half hour is where it all comes together.

heres the link on google video
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...edom+to+fascism
necrophagistnile
QUOTE(Corbin @ Dec 11 2006, 02:35 AM) *

probably one of the most important films ever made, be sure to watch it all the way through, the last half hour is where it all comes together.

heres the link on google video
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...edom+to+fascism



Agreed....this movie scared me more than any horror/suspense movie ever could. Thanks to Kevin for the links. Ron Paul for President!
Smurf
http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Per...s/JustNoLaw.htm

please dont shoot/flame the messenger but can anyone reply to this?

i haven't personally clarified every section of it but a few places cite it...

any truth to it?

just so you know... i am fully behind alex in his pursuit for truth and attempting to topple the corrupt powers in play at the moment... we are all in desperate need of something different at the moment.. and i am not even american...

keep up the good work sacred cow...
FunkBone
For more excellent documentaries on this topic see also 'Money, Banking and The Fedreral Reserve' (Ludwig von Mises Institute) and 'The Money Masters - How International Bankers Gained Control of America' (Bill Still, themoneymasters.com). Also there is a great book by Murray Rothbard called 'What has Government Done to Our Money'.
Manji
The XVI Amendment:

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

Does that amendment give congross the power required to act an income tax upon the wages and labors of "Average" American citizens? That is how I interperate it.

When I brought up the movie to my friend, he considered that argument to be bogus because, there is a law that requires you to file a ten forty. He showed me in my College history text book the xvI amendment and said that amendment gives our government to enforce an income tax upon us.

Wow, he sure shut me down real fast. Is he right, or mistaken?
FunkBone
Manji - Watch part 3 again where he interviews the former Commissioner and Tax Code author Sheldon Cohen and asks him to define 'income'. According to the Supreme Court (Somebody v. Somebody Else) it applies to corporate gains, not your wages for labor which are your private property. Your friend is mistaken.
Manji
"tax protestors" have been taking the same position for years.

Essentially, most of them argue that the 16th Amendment to the Constitution was not properly ratified. There are a wide range of reasons they say this, I have looked at all of them, and all of them verge on the ridiculous or the insane.

The 16th Amendment reads:

"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.?

I should point out that before the 16th amendment was ratified in 1913, congress already had the power to tax incomes, it just had to apportion the tax burden to each state based on each state's population. The 16th Amendment changed changed the requirement for this apportionment.

The power of congress to levy taxes on the population comes from the Constitution, Article 1, Section 8, which says in the openning line:

"The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;"

The reasons the "tax protestors" verge on the insane, is that even if their points are valid (which they aren't), the Supremem Court has approved congresses' right to impose income taxes, thus making it the legitimate law of the land.

In Brushaber v. Union Pacific Railroad, the Supreme Court indicated that the 16th Amendment did not give the Congress a new power to tax incomes, as Congress already had that power. The Court ruled that the Sixteenth Amendment made the distinction between a direct tax and an indirect tax constitutionally irrelevant with respect to the apportionment of income taxes by removing the apportionment requirement for income taxes. In Brushaber, the Court upheld the validity of the Federal income tax statute under the U.S. Constitution as amended by the Sixteenth Amendment.

Justice Butler wrote this regarding the Court's decision:
It was not the purpose or the effect of that amendment to bring any new subject within the taxing power. Congress already had the power to tax all incomes...The Amendment relieved from that requirement and obliterated the distinction in that respect between taxes on income that are direct taxes and those that are not, and so put on the same basis all incomes "from whatever source derived"...After full consideration, this court declared that income may be defined as gain derived from capital, from labor, or from both combined, including profit gained through sale or conversion of capital.

So the Supreme Court has ruled that it is appropriate for the congress to levy and collect taxes on income. There is no arguement, the tax protestors simply don't have a leg to stand on.

I am in favor of completely abolishing the federal income tax and moving to a federal sales tax; what is known as the "Fair Tax." This would eliminate the IRS, streamline the tax collection process, completely eliminate loopholes that some large corporations and individuals take advantage of, make "old money" families pay taxes (which they currently don't, to a large degree), encourage saving, and increase the quantity of money collected by the federal governmet; it is a tax on consumption or expenditure, not income.
FunkBone
OK I won't argue the definition of 'income' with you, but can we discuss 'voluntary'?
Manji
Supporter of this idea point to the fact that the Form 1040 instruction book that the tax system is voluntary. They also point to the Supreme Court’s opinion in Flora v. United States, 362 U.S. 145, 176 (1960), that "[o]ur system of taxation is based upon voluntary assessment and payment, not upon distraint."

The word “voluntary,” as used in Flora and in IRS publications, refers to United State’s system of allowing taxpayers to determine the correct amount of tax and complete the appropriate returns, rather than have the government determine tax for them. The requirement to file an income tax return is not voluntary and is clearly set forth in sections 6011(a), 6012(a), etc., and 6072(a). You may also check out Treas. Reg. § 1.6011-1(a).

Here is just a sample of the case law regarding the issue of the “voluntary nature” of the U.S. Tax Code:

Helvering v. Mitchell, 303 U.S. 391, 399 (1938) – the U.S. Supreme Court stated that “in assessing income taxes, the Government relies primarily upon the disclosure by the taxpayer of the relevant facts . . . in his annual return. To ensure full and honest disclosure, to discourage fraudulent attempts to evade the tax, Congress imposes [either criminal or civil] sanctions.”

United States v. Gerads, 999 F.2d 1255, 1256 (8th Cir. 1993) – the court held that “[a]ny assertion that the payment of income taxes is voluntary is without merit.”

United States v. Tedder, 787 F.2d 540, 542 (10th Cir. 1986) – the court upheld a conviction for willfully failing to file a return, stating that the premise “that the tax system is somehow ‘voluntary’ . . . is incorrect.”

Johnson v. Commissioner, T.C. Memo. 1999-312, 78 T.C.M. (CCH) 468, 471 (1999) – the court found Johnson liable for the failure to file penalty and rejected his argument “that the tax system is voluntary so that he cannot be forced to comply” as “frivolous.”

Wilcox v. Commissioner, 848 F.2d 1007, 1008 (9th Cir. 1988) – the court rejected Wilcox’s argument that payment of taxes is voluntary for American citizens, stating that “paying taxes is not voluntary” and imposing a $1,500 penalty against Wilcox for raising frivolous claims.

Bonaccorso v. Commissioner, T.C. Memo. 2005-278, 90 T.C.M. (CCH) 554 (2005) – the taxpayer filed zero returns based on the argument that he found no Code section that made him liable for any income tax. The court held that the taxpayer’s argument was frivolous citing to section 1 (imposes an income tax), section 63 (defines taxable income as gross income minus deductions), and section 61 (defines gross income). The court also imposed a $10,000 sanction against the taxpayer under section 6673 for making frivolous arguments.
Roxdog
Being FORCED to tell the government how much money you make each year is a violation of a person's 5th amendment.
Manji
But you have nothing to say about the good points I made. What about the fact that there is a law that says the government can tax you on your labor and wages?

I mean, I brought up some pretty good points.
FunkBone
What law is that? I mean the actual federal law - not court decisions or amendments granting authority to pass laws but the actual law itself. What is it? Point me to it. I wanna read it.
Bing the Merciless
QUOTE(FunkBone @ Dec 30 2006, 05:21 AM) *

What law is that? I mean the actual federal law - not court decisions or amendments granting authority to pass laws but the actual law itself. What is it? Point me to it. I wanna read it.


I watched the video and thought it was little more than a self serving ad for Russo. The 9/11 industry is getting a little out of control, don't you think?

There were a few interesting points, but basically it was Russo trying to get his face on camera.

Perhaps he is a shill for the "NWO" making people think that they don't have to pay taxes and then they end up in some internment camp for tax avoidence. Now that's conspiracy for you.
Manji
I would have to disagree with idea that Aaron Russo is implying that people stop paying their taxes and go to Jail. I am very confident he states that is exactly the kind of thing he does not want any person to do. Auron said he files anyways.

All it is like this. He just wants everyone America to realize that it is false and rebel against it. Can't put everyone in jail.

Well, I researched and found that is not the case. Although I am against this kind of tax, what Aaron Russo is saying that there is no law is false.
FunkBone
And the law is...........where again?
Manji
Isn't the 16th amendment the law?
FunkBone
No, the Amendment is the authorization for a law - that no one has seen or read. Thus this wonderful documentary. There is also an extremely boring read by Irwin Schiff called 'The Federal Mafia: How It Illegally Imposes and Unlawfully Collects Income Tax'. Do you know the difference between 'illegal' and 'unlawful'?
FunkBone
Listening to Irwin Schiff explain things in his video is far easier than trying to read his book, which has got to be as monotonous as the tax code itself, if not so voluminous. I found these:
Irwin Schiff's Secrets of Living an Income Tax-Free Life 1
Irwin Schiff's Secrets of Living an Income Tax-Free Life 2
Irwin Schiff at Hotel San Remo in Las Vegas
The last one is more of an general economics lecture he gave right after 9-11.
FunkBone
Aaron Russo: The Architecture of the Prison Planet
Alex Jones interviews Aaron Russo.
Roxdog
QUOTE(Manji @ Dec 30 2006, 05:03 AM) *

What about the fact that there is a law that says the government can tax you on your labor and wages?


Please post your source.
FunkBone
Where is that law Roxdog? Are you referring to the 16th Amendment?
1776blues
QUOTE(Manji @ Dec 27 2006, 03:21 AM) *

The XVI Amendment:

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

Does that amendment give congross the power required to act an income tax upon the wages and labors of "Average" American citizens? That is how I interperate it.

When I brought up the movie to my friend, he considered that argument to be bogus because, there is a law that requires you to file a ten forty. He showed me in my College history text book the xvI amendment and said that amendment gives our government to enforce an income tax upon us.

Wow, he sure shut me down real fast. Is he right, or mistaken?



Since it was not ratified by all states and the Supreme court says the 16 ammendment is not constitutional. There are monetary challenges to anyone who can prove there is a law, so you friend may want to try and collect. But if Judges, the IRS, DA's and politicians cannot show, your friend is badly mistaken and you have been took. That tax only lines the pockets of the Federal Reserve, it does not pay for any of the government services. RON PAUL 2008!!!!!!!
charismagician
I have asked many people to show me the actual law that says "file fucker" but none of them can point to it, including a guy who works for the IRS. This is because the government does EVERYTHING roundabout to confuse and distort the american people. Taxation without representation is the very reason america exists.

I file every year cuz I don't want uncle sam to take my house (my house, that's rich) even tho I am only borrowing it from the government. Income tax is wrong. Some people think that it's my duty to help out the government but the actual truth is that the government makes PLENTY of taxes on the rest of the shit that we buy sell and consume including property tax. Why must I give up my hard earned income just cuz I made it. If I were rich I wouldn't have to pay hardly any taxes (probably none). Uncle Sam can bite me....

IPB Image
FunkBone
"... While some in government did conspire to deceive and defraud the American public, this deception has continued not because of mass secrecy but because of mass ignorance. The ignorance of IRS employees, the ignorance of the tax professionals, and the ignorance of the general public. Ironically, for decades some have tried to fight against the tax using various dubious theories and legal arguments because these so-called tax protesters were also ignorant about what the law itself actually says. The problem is not the law itself, but the misrepresentation and misapplication of the law. Millions of Americans have been defrauded, extorted, harassed, threatened and prosecuted - all based on a deception that the enforcers themselves (for the most part) did not understand. A falsehood this long-lived, this universally accepted and of this magnitude has tremendous staying power. Human psychology being what it is, many people would rather cling to their long held but erroneous beliefs than face the ugly truth as it sits in front of them. Throughout history the experts and the public have often clung to incorrect 'common knowledge' until uncomfortably forced to face the cold hard evidence. The truth, though sometimes unpleasant, is better than a lie, and the truth is that some individuals inside the United States government orchestrated and sucsessfully executed the most massive fraud and extortion racket in the history of mankind. What the people will do about it remains to be seen."

-Larken Rose (the guy that made the preceding video)
FunkBone
Fresh link:
America: Freedom to Fascism

This is the juror he interviewed in the film:



sunupu
You know a man (sorry, old story so I'm drawing a blank on the name) who worked in tax relief asked that same question and nobody had an answer.

There's technically no rule that says "pay taxes". There are rules that say, "Don't avoid taxes", but that's not always the same thing.
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